logolinksrand Hamburg City Freelancer Server Foren-Übersicht
Players:3/64    *Mod here*
Server Load:0 msec 
Deaths per Minute:0
logorechts  
  SERVERIP : hc.flserver.de:2302
Discord Community: https://discord.gg/xh4ckhY


 
  Portal  •  Forum-FAQ  •   Suchen  •  Registrieren  •  Einloggen, um private Nachrichten zu lesen  •  Login  
  Donation/Spenden  •   Donation List  •   HC Forum Rangsystem Info  •   Player Rankings  •   Banned Players  
/

   
 High-lvl Shields in game Nächstes Thema anzeigen
Vorheriges Thema anzeigen
Neues Thema eröffnenNeue Antwort erstellen
Autor Nachricht
Wieros
Corporal




Playtime: 14h


Beiträge: 7

Beitrag Titel: High-lvl Shields in game
Verfasst am: 16.10.07 15:34
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

I am maybe just a noob, but i cant find any base where the Adv.Protector(lvl8-gravitron) is sold (except the HC base - where the freighter type is sold) I think that is not so unbalancing for heavy fighters.

The same way, i did not find any place where Adv.Barrier is sold (thats absolutly not unbalancing as it has the same characteristic as the Adv.Brigandine)

The only unbalancing shield is the Adv.Champion (ok its really), but the lvl.9 gravitron (Champion) is slightly worse than Adv.Brigandine - and there is no place to buy it! So I ask why?
Wieros is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
RenderG
Corporal




Playtime: 304h
Webmissions: 3


Beiträge: 176
Wohnort: Moscow, Russia, OEG

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 16.10.07 15:35
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

Buy a TITAN
RenderG is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht sendenE-Mail senden
Wieros
Corporal




Playtime: 14h


Beiträge: 7

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 16.10.07 15:42
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

?
that slow and ugly "coirsair gunboat"?
Wieros is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Kirika



kreuz_bronze

Webmissions: 29


Beiträge: 2048

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 16.10.07 15:47
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

It got this shield mounted...buy it, give the shield to a friend, buy the ship you want then and get the shield back. Done
Kirika is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Wieros
Corporal




Playtime: 14h


Beiträge: 7

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 16.10.07 15:50
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

ok I understand that! thx
Wieros is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
ice_cold_death
Admiral


financial_expert_gold time_bandit_gold basefinder_gold jumpholefinder_gold

combat_expert_bronze rpgchar

Playtime: 2004h
Webmissions: 243


Beiträge: 7440
Wohnort: Magdeburg

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 16.10.07 18:36
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

it is really umständlich but it will be useful
this shield is the best shield für cloaking valkyrie and blood dragon

_________________
Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.
ice_cold_death is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Wieros
Corporal




Playtime: 14h


Beiträge: 7

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 13:17
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

im planning to buy a Blood Dragon, and thats why i asked about the Adv.Protector

And what do u think about the other 2 shields: the AdvBarrier and the Champion ?? - i think the HC Base should sell them (only the heavy fighter type)!
Wieros is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
ice_cold_death
Admiral


financial_expert_gold time_bandit_gold basefinder_gold jumpholefinder_gold

combat_expert_bronze rpgchar

Playtime: 2004h
Webmissions: 243


Beiträge: 7440
Wohnort: Magdeburg

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 13:29
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

no,
i asked some time ago the same question to make adv. protector shield for heavy figther available
nearly nobody accepted this idea
and i dont agree now with this idea

_________________
Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.
ice_cold_death is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Amused_To_Death





Webmissions: 29


Beiträge: 17

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 17:49
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

I have no idea why anyone would be against Admins making these items available to players. They are, after all, standard equipment really... it's not as if anything "new" would be added.

The reason items such as the Adv. Protector and Champion Shields are not readily available is because Microsoft rushed the game out before it was completed. Is it not reasonable, therefore, for Admins to take steps to rectify this if able to do so?
Amused_To_Death is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
w0dk4
Lieutenant


financial_expert_bronze time_bandit_gold jumpholefinder_bronze rpgchar

urgestein_gold hcl04_silber developer kreuz_gold


Deppenadmin² und sich damit abgefunden !
Playtime: 1008h
Webmissions: 8


Beiträge: 9012
Wohnort: Heidelberg

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 17:55
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

No. Adv. Champion Shields are unbalanced, they have 12xxx hitpoints and have better protection against certain weapons.
In vanilla FL there is a certain balance between class 8 graviton and class 10 positron shields. Im not sure about molecular shields atm. but in general, graviton shields are stronger than molecular and positron shields.

_________________
http://www.freeworldstidesofwar.com
http://the-starport.net
w0dk4 is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Amused_To_Death





Webmissions: 29


Beiträge: 17

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 18:56
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

A single Tizona Del Cid would need...
5.55 hits to drop an Adv. Brigandine H.F. Shield
6.67 hits to drop an Adv. Barrier H.F. Shield
11.1 hits to drop an Adv. Champion H.F. Shield

This initially looks very unbalanced, I agree, however things become a lot closer when measured against a full gun configuration.

A gun config of 2 x Tizona Del Cid and 4 x Nomad Blaster would need...
1.95 hits to drop an Adv. Brigandine H.F. Shield
2.21 hits to drop an Adv. Barrier H.F. Shield
3.39 hits to drop an Adv. Champion H.F. Shield

All of those guns fire at a rate of 4 shots per second, so we are really talking about roughly 0.3 of a second difference before a shield is dropped.

For those that may be interested, it would take 1.81 hits to drop an Adv. Protector H.F. Shield with the same configuration.

N.B. None of the calculations take into account any automatic shield regeneration that may occur between hits.

I am not seeking to change how things are on the server in any way, as the true "balance" is achieved by everyone having equal access to the same equipment. I just wished to point out that things are not as unbalanced as they first appear.
Amused_To_Death is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Nosferatu
Captain


financial_expert_bronze time_bandit_silber basefinder_gold jumpholefinder_gold

rpgchar urgestein_gold financial_supporter kreuz_gold


Fednap-Admin
Playtime: 947h
Webmissions: 183


Beiträge: 8333

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 19:04
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

Zitat:

however things become a lot closer when measured against a full gun configuration.


1,95 --> 3,39 that mean an Adv. Champion H.F. Shield protects 74% better than an Adv. Brigandine H.F. Shield
Nosferatu is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
[NIB]~Alarich
Lieutenant Commander


financial_expert_bronze basefinder_gold jumpholefinder_gold rpgchar

financial_supporter kreuz_silber
Ich bin der FL-Doc !
Playtime: 513h
Webmissions: 22


Beiträge: 1647

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 19:22
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

Due to the fact, that a volley hits the target fully or not, this correct calculation indicates, that it takes 2 full volleys (2 Tiz, 4 Bla) to kill a VHF Adv. Brigandine Shield and 4 to kill the VHF Adv. Champion Shield.

=> in this case the Adv. Champions offers 100% more protection to the mentioned weapon configuration

_________________
[NIB]~Alarich

Die [NIB]elungen werden wiederauferstehen...
[NIB]~Alarich is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
CatDog
Captain


financial_expert_bronze time_bandit_gold basefinder_gold jumpholefinder_gold

rpgchar financial_supporter

Playtime: 2703h
Webmissions: 645


Beiträge: 3567
Wohnort: Fearsome Secret

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 19:28
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

Whats the point anyways ? Every a bit expierend player will have this shild then , you give only newer players who didnt know a disadvantage .

_________________
Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.Wolfs Forum
The Starport
CatDog is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht sendenWebsite dieses Benutzers besuchenMSN Messenger
Amused_To_Death





Webmissions: 29


Beiträge: 17

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 19:34
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

Against the configuration I used as an example, yes.

Change the config though, say to 2 x Tizona and 4 x Kraken2, and you get the following...
2.26 hits to drop the Adv. Brigandine
2.42 hits to drop the Adv. Barrier
2.84 hits to drop the Adv. Champion

a difference of 26% between the Champ and the Brig.

I admit this is an unlikely setup on most servers, as players will naturally use Nomad Guns due to the fact that energy use need not be a consideration (yet another flaw in the game :S).

Like I said, the true balance on the server is achieved not by denying players use of the Adv. Champion Shield, but by making the same equipment available to every player. If Champs were available, everyone would use them, there would be balance (sadly that would not guarantee harmony though Rolling Eyes ).
Amused_To_Death is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Jason
Sergeant


financial_supporter

Playtime: 310h
Webmissions: 1


Beiträge: 3335

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 19:37
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

theres a balance betwen the players than....
not betwen the equipment

_________________
Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen.
[quote="White-star"]egal hauptsache tot[/quote]
Lasse du Honkytonky
Posted Image, might have been reduced in size. Click Image to view fullscreen. FTW!
Jason is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht sendenMSN Messenger
Hawc





Webmissions: 93


Beiträge: 154
Wohnort: Slovenia

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 19:55
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

ice_cold_death hat folgendes geschrieben:
no,
i asked some time ago the same question to make adv. protector shield for heavy figther available
nearly nobody accepted this idea
and i dont agree now with this idea


but the adv. protector HF shield is available. As said before it comes with titan.
Hawc is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht sendenE-Mail sendenWebsite dieses Benutzers besuchenMSN Messenger
[NIB]~Alarich
Lieutenant Commander


financial_expert_bronze basefinder_gold jumpholefinder_gold rpgchar

financial_supporter kreuz_silber
Ich bin der FL-Doc !
Playtime: 513h
Webmissions: 22


Beiträge: 1647

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 20:03
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

Amused_To_Death hat folgendes geschrieben:
Against the configuration I used as an example, yes.

Change the config though, say to 2 x Tizona and 4 x Kraken2, and you get the following...


To be more scientific:
Kraken 2 damages
Graviton (= Adv. Champ) shields with 351,6 per hit * 4 = 1406,4
Positron (= Adv. Brig) shields with 293 per hit * 4 = 1172
Molecular (= Adv. Barr) shields with 234,40 per hit * 4 = 937,6

Tizona damages
Graviton (= Adv. Champ) shields with 993,6 per hit * 2 = 1987,2
Positron (= Adv. Brig) shields with 1490,4 per hit * 2 = 2980,8
Molecular (= Adv. Barr) shields with 1242 per hit * 2 = 2484

Adv. Champ. has shieldstrength of 11038 / ( 1406,4 + 1987,2 ) = 3,25
Adv. Brig. has shieldstrength of 8280 / ( 1172 + 2980,8 ) = 1,99
Adv. Barr. has shieldstrength of 8280 / ( 937,6 + 2484 ) = 2,42

1,99 = 2 hits to drop the Adv. Brigandine
2,42 = 3 hits to drop the Adv. Barrier
3,25 = 4 hits to drop the Adv. Champion

Your calculation of the 2Tiz/4Kraken 2 configuration simply was wrong.
I corrected it - that's all.
The outcome delivers a clear message.

Assumption:
the target doesn't move, so the slightly time-shifted full volley of both, Kraken 2 (700m/s) and Tizonas (600m/s), hit the target.


a difference of 100% between the Champ and the Brig.

I guess this makes things clear - the Adv. Champion Shields are ubershields compared to the Adv. Brigandine.

[Edit] Better, Atd?

_________________
[NIB]~Alarich

Die [NIB]elungen werden wiederauferstehen...

Zuletzt bearbeitet von [NIB]~Alarich am 18.10.07 07:20, insgesamt 2-mal bearbeitet
[NIB]~Alarich is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Amused_To_Death





Webmissions: 29


Beiträge: 17

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 20:55
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

If you are qoing to quote me, would you please use what I actually said...

Your "quote" contains a lot of edits, changes and additions... it is not what I said by any stretch of the imagination. :S
Amused_To_Death is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
]Imperium[Bas
Commander


financial_expert_bronze time_bandit_gold basefinder_gold jumpholefinder_gold

rpgchar financial_supporter
Helper Rank I
Playtime: 1250h
Webmissions: 36


Beiträge: 4626

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 17.10.07 22:55
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

Yes, but he had marked the changes

_________________
Bastis Blog
]Imperium[ - Immortal[/b]
Since 03.05.05
Invalid Validation Solution
]Imperium[Bas is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht sendenWebsite dieses Benutzers besuchenAIM-NameYahoo MessengerMSN Messenger
Amused_To_Death





Webmissions: 29


Beiträge: 17

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 18.10.07 03:15
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

The changes make no sense whatsoever, and he then uses them to conclude that the Adv. Champion is 3 times better than the Adv. Brigandine...

very scientific :S

The only part with any accuracy is the comment about the variation in projectile speeds.
Amused_To_Death is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
[NIB]~Alarich
Lieutenant Commander


financial_expert_bronze basefinder_gold jumpholefinder_gold rpgchar

financial_supporter kreuz_silber
Ich bin der FL-Doc !
Playtime: 513h
Webmissions: 22


Beiträge: 1647

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 18.10.07 05:14
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

Your calculation of the 2Tiz/4Kraken 2 configuration simply was wrong.
I corrected it - that's all.
The outcome delivers a clear message.

_________________
[NIB]~Alarich

Die [NIB]elungen werden wiederauferstehen...
[NIB]~Alarich is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Amused_To_Death





Webmissions: 29


Beiträge: 17

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 18.10.07 08:01
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

Yep, you are right that my calculations were incorrect... I forgot to make the necessary adjustments for the variances in the Tizona damage. :S

However I disagree that this means the Adv. Champ is therefore 100% more effective than the Adv. Brigandine.

Neither of our calcualtions make any allowance for partial shield regeneration between hits, or for any individual guns that miss. Your figures show that if even 1 gun was to miss against the Brig, it would probably mean a further volley was required to complete the dropping of the shield, which would bring it up to 3 volleys required (rounded up, as in your calculations). There is quite a bit more leeway for missed shots with the Barrier and Champ calculations.

I really shouldn't have introduced the figures to the discussion anyway (particularly when I fail to check them before posting ), as they digress from my main point... which was that this shield would not unbalance the server, because everyone would use it, if it was available.

Actually, it would unbalance it as far as the NPCs are concerned... but they are unlikely to post a complaint here. 8)
Amused_To_Death is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Silencer





Webmissions: 48


Beiträge: 90
Wohnort: Nürnberg

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 18.10.07 08:36
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

But i cannot see any sense in it.
Sure, it would be "balanced" again, when everybody uses the Championshields... But what would be the difference?!?
Now its balanced cause everyone uses Brigandine shields, later all us champion shields...
Ok, they last a bit longer, but after all nothing changes but the name of the shield... (and maybe the well paid missions become a bit easier to newbies)

So i can't see a good argument why everybody on this server should buy new shields just to get the same "balanced" state like it is at the moment with the brigandines...
Silencer is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Amused_To_Death





Webmissions: 29


Beiträge: 17

Beitrag Titel:
Verfasst am: 18.10.07 09:44
Antworten mit ZitatNach oben

I never advocated that things should change, I merely disagreed with the argument that it would unbalance things.
Amused_To_Death is offline Benutzer-Profile anzeigenPrivate Nachricht senden
Beiträge der letzten Zeit anzeigen:      
Neues Thema eröffnenNeue Antwort erstellen


 Gehe zu:   



Nächstes Thema anzeigen
Vorheriges Thema anzeigen
Du kannst keine Beiträge in dieses Forum schreiben.
Du kannst auf Beiträge in diesem Forum nicht antworten.
Du kannst deine Beiträge in diesem Forum nicht bearbeiten.
Du kannst deine Beiträge in diesem Forum nicht löschen.
Du kannst an Umfragen in diesem Forum nicht mitmachen.


 



Das letzte Eck
Last 10 Deaths


Google





   
  17 users on website
powered by 230 volt, phpBB with modifications by Niwo. Alle Zeiten sind GMT + 1 Stunde
This page has been viewed 230395407 times.
Servertime: 17:34:00 Current server uptime: 36 days, 0 users, load average: 0.08, 0.02, Server Disk Space free: 24867 MB


Spendenkontostand / donating account balance
Page generation time: 0.6465s (PHP: 67% - SQL: 33%) - SQL queries: 22 - GZIP disabled - Debug off